You are here

Dumb Question

Dumb question:  Since becoming vegan tends to cause weight loss, why doesn't the pro-vegan portion of our population concentrate their efforts on the people like those in the following documentary?  It is a potential multi-billion dollar market, for you business  types out there, if you can do such in a nutritionally sound and complete manner (please see my posts regarding lysine and other nutrients missing from most vegan diets).

http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=1673240771

I know I lost 1/3 of my body weight within three months each time I went vegan (probably because vegan diets tend to be so low in fat).  If this was to be applied to people like those in the documentary, we might save American from collapsing under its own weight, so to speak.

"We used to play for silver, now we play for life"
-- Jack Straw (as in Straw Man Specifications), Grateful Dead

i'm just gonna leave this here
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=vegan
seems to be workin so far.

0 likes

Yes; longwinded today... got a lot of housework I'm avoiding.  :)

Ok; any sources that don't support your position are bunk. Got it!

Some vegan foods are low fat; some aren't... whether you lose weight or not on a vegan diet is neither predetermined for all veg eaters, nor relevant to the initial question of whether it's a good primary reason to explore veg eating, which I believe was your original premise... still seems like the weakest one in the lineup, to me.

Re: Alz and other dementias, I was quoting info from a source known as a good assimilator of available data... go looking yourself, see what turns up-- you're right that I have not coughed up the hard studies individually, which I will attempt soon-- time limits exist, now that I've squandered all my free time on longwinded posts about other stuff... will try tho soon; this part of your point is valid, though many peer reviewed studies are not publicly available online, except as links from health organizations of one type or another... if you want the original source, you may need to pay subscription fees to JAMA or pay for continuing ed from researchers in the field, but I'll see what I can find in terms of news releases etc...you should look too, if you're interested!

But FTR, I am not basing this assessment-- that dementia is related to vascular disease and cellular insulin resistance, separately or in concert-- on one source; within medical circles it's not a big secret... EVERY person on my caseload with dementia (alz or other type) has hypertension, hypercholesterolemia/ hyperlipidemia, diabetes mellitis type II, and heart disease related to vascular occlusion... I don't even have to look these diagnosis codes up anymore, they're so common among dementia patients. There was a study in the news recently about diabetes doubling your risk for Alz; duh, was my take, based on what I see in chart reviews day in & day out... such a strong correlation isn't cause/ effect, but neither is is chance. The elephant in the room of modern Western health care is that these are diet-mediated conditions! Pfizer et al disapprove of this fact; but fact it remains...Anyway, hey, don't take my word for it: if you do the research yourself, I bet it won't be 'bunk.'  ;)

"The truth is out there." -- Agent Mulder

0 likes

another day, another pwn.

0 likes

HCM:  Actually, I would like to see evidence regarding your comment about vegan diets preventing Alzheimer's disease, if you can provide such...

Here ya go:

http://vegweb.com/index.php?topic=41498.0

:)

0 likes

.com

;D

You're looking for excuses to disregard data that you yourself didn't bring to the discussion; which is fine by me-- whatever floats your boat!-- but is neither an original nor a productive strategy for coping with new ideas.

Sorry guy-- you don't get to pick the research other people share. Bring your own ball to the game, and you can choose the pitch; not otherwise!

0 likes

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."--John Adams

http://www.scottfillmer.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/facts.jpg

0 likes

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."--John Adams

http://www.scottfillmer.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/facts.jpg

<like!>

0 likes

"The truth is out there." -- Agent Mulder

LOLsssss

You should just leave it at that

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."--John Adams

http://www.scottfillmer.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/facts.jpg

Love!!!  :)>>>

0 likes

i swear u shit never ending quotations :)

0 likes

"like marmite on toast.... blech"
-- amymylove

0 likes

LMAO FB that was good...

nsfdri has the squirts today :) being vegan does help with constipation :)

0 likes

I leave the thread for a few days and it's completely different from where the discussion began--with no discernible theme apart from HCM starting a thesis on ass kicking. I must say I don't understand the whole quote thing, as I am getting a very troll-ish feeling from this whole discussion. When did the food fight thread become the troll thread? Anyway, what are the main overarching questions that we are trying to tease out here? Whether a vegan diet is deficient in individual vitamins? Is that where we're going, as we're wading through as this?

0 likes

the quotes and such all started here, VR:
http://vegweb.com/index.php?topic=41002.0

._.

0 likes

Back to the original topic...  ;)b

I was ovo-lacto for most of my life (from the time I was 8 until I turned 21) and was always borderline overweight (165 lbs at 5'8").  Six years vegan, I gradually lost weight and now weigh between 130-135 pounds, but I do eat right and exercise 4-5 days a week.  It was also very easy for me to get back to my pre-pregnancy weight, which I think is largely because of my diet.  I was comfortably in my size 4 jeans in less than two weeks.

My husband's weight loss was similar to OP's.  He's 6' 1.5" and weighed 215-220 (up to 250 in the winter months).  Within 6 months of going vegan, he was down to 155 pounds and has stayed there.  He's actually on the low side of his BMI, but takes dietary supplements to keep his blood pressure in check.  I have never had problems w/ BP, cholesterol, thyroid, etc.

Everyone is different.

0 likes

i doubt those points will have much appeal to obese people unfortunately 

0 likes

i doubt those points will have much appeal to obese people unfortunately  

Maybe you don't give them enough credit.  I've known quite a few that are damn good people on a lot of different levels.

i am not saying that obese people are unsuperior human beings, to me i feel like if i said something like that to them it would be pretty rude...

"hey you eat way more than a skinny person so you should force veganism on yourself for the better good and skinny people should get to indulge in whatever"

seriously

0 likes

i doubt those points will have much appeal to obese people unfortunately 

Maybe you don't give them enough credit.  I've known quite a few that are damn good people on a lot of different levels.

I think maybe AML means that there are already so many reasons (more immediately obvious to the uninformed, yet still vastly ignored!) to eat better/ exercise/ avoid SAD diet problems, that these points-- while good ideas-- are still low on the totem pole of SAD-eater priorities... if 'not having a heart attack at 45' or 'not having multiple amputations from diabetes complications by 50' or 'not having prescription med bills higher than any other monthly expense' don't do it-- well, what's a bit more or less animal suffering/  environmental impact?! It's not saying 'they aren't good people'; just that if the other reasons to eat well/ exercise haven't kicked in, these reasons are unlikely to sway folks. AML, if that's not it, correct me!  :)

PS-- I view obesity as a symptom vs root cause of the problems under discussion... I think it's often a symptom poor eating and exercise habits, but (in the absence of sedentary lifestyle/ poor nutrition) not necessarily a cause of problems in and of itself, except maybe for joint issues related to weightbearing... what do you guys think? I've only seen correlation studies, not cause/ effect; if you control for cholesterol, cardiovascular status, activity level, and blood pressure, is there evidence suggesting obesity *itself* can cause illness (other than aggravation of lower extremity weightbearing/ joint integrity issues)? I'd be interested to see research with obesity as a cause rather than correlation/ symptom/ risk factor... maybe slightly off topic, but maybe not; and it's an interesting question, I think!

0 likes

thanks hcm... you always able to articulate my view points with such pizazz <3

i just think these are weak arguments to truly bring to the table... idk

i think the health benefit would be a stronger argument than straight out saying that they are obese from eating so much and should be vegan because of it... it just seems like trying to guilt trip the person who probably already feels dumpy into being vegan... my opinion of course

0 likes

thanks hcm... you always able to articulate my view points with such pizazz <3

i just think these are weak arguments to truly bring to the table... idk

i think the health benefit would be a stronger argument than straight out saying that they are obese from eating so much and should be vegan because of it... it just seems like trying to guilt trip the person who probably already feels dumpy into being vegan... my opinion of course

As I said before, vegans should and already are, promoting veganism/plant based eating as a weight loss tool.  But not by focusing on "you're fat because you eat too much".  People pretty much know that already.

However, I agree with you Amy that people would be better off if health remained the focus, and obesity would take care of itself.  The next wave of vegan advocates are taking exactly that approach.  Get healthy and you will loose weight. 
This video talk of the health benefits to society of a plant based diet, but also includes interviews with people whom have lost a tremendous amount of weight.

http://www.vimeo.com/30171578

0 likes

Amy, being obese has nothing to do with the level of nutritional education people have.  Now I can not site real studies on this, just my personal observations.  Look at the staff of medical facilities.  These people should know.

From personal experience, I can say the weight issues I have dealt with most of my life and still deal with are more a symptom of bad coping mechanisms when it comes to stress than lack of knowlege.  I am a stress eater from a family of stress eaters.  I maxed out at a size 26 pants.  I am now about size 22.    My smallest in the last 10 yrs was right before my mom was diagnosed as terminally ill and that was 18/20.  I have never been smaller than a 12 and that only lasted a few months in high school.  If you would get all my family together, I would be one of the skinny ones. 

I think the thing that is holding me back from a total vegan diet is I am very aware of my blood sugar spikes and lows and how they affect my appitite.  I have not found protien sources that have a high enough concentration that I like (I don't like a lot of the highly processed things)  to keep things level.  Even whole grains will trigger that cycle for me.  When I am not fighting injuries/illness, I suprize most people with my activity level. 

For me, if you try to guilt me into eating healthier, my emotional eating can kick in and I will do worse.  I know this from repeated experience.  Obesity is much more complicated in "real life" than simply adjusting the calorie/activity ratio.

0 likes

Pages

Log in or register to post comments