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What do you all think of it? I won't lie. I've looked at a fair amount, mostly out of sheer curiosity, "do these girls actually like doing this?" and "guys actually love looking at this stuff" type looking. I really hope real sex isn't like this (I'm a virgin) and that guys don't expect girls to do that type of stuff in real life.

I don't know, I don't want to do my whole rant, because I'm sure most of you will say what I want to rant.

Discuss

Oh dear. Wait til bp gets ahold of this one.

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One word: Photoshop. Two words: Trick photography.
A lot of stuff you see in photos has been fotoshopped to bits, just like model photos. Airbrushed, re-sized, retouched (or re-groped).

And a lot of what you see in porn movies isn't actually possible. I mean, think about it. It looks like they're alone but they're surrounded by crew, tools, lights, noise...ah the magic of the re-take, the magic of cutting and splicing. Most films are transformed in the cutting. Porn even more so.

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Oh dear. Wait til bp gets ahold of this one.

where is my ten foot stick when i need it?  :-D

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I. Like. Porn.

In principle.

Do I like the stereotypes and sexism that run amok in the porn that dominates our culture today?  No.  Do I like the idea of being sex-positive and embracing human sexuality?  For being OK with saying "Hey, this turns me on!"?  Yes. 

This one's gonna be fun.  :devilsmile:

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I have many mixed feelings towards porn--I think in general it's an industry that exploits women and others--I'm sure a lot of people are there of their own accord and happily partake in the process--but many are not and I just think that is sad a business profits on the suffering of others. If you want to be in porn or look at porn that is so your business and none of mine. I certainly would not judge someone for their participation--and of course there are several levels from soft to hard core.

In my own personal life I have had two relationships where the guy worshiped porn--it made me feel inadequate (to say the least)--especially when the guy would rather watch or look at porn or go to the strip club than be with me. That can really make a person feel like shit knowing someone you love has such little respect for you. I think it's safe to say some of my feelings of worthlessness and hatred for my body can be traced back (at least in some small way) to these relationships. How is a person supposed to compeat with those images of fantasy?

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"Real sex" is whatever you and your partner choose it to be.  Open, honest communication about likes and dislikes works wonders.

eta:  The last time people were talking about pom (pomegranate), I read porn, so I thought I read this subject heading wrong again and opened the thread expecting to find a post about juice.

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I have many mixed feelings towards porn--I think in general it's an industry that exploits women and others--I'm sure a lot of people are there of their own accord and happily partake in the process--but many are not and I just think that is sad a business profits on the suffering of others.

What is your basis for saying that many sex workers partake in their work involuntarily?  I don't think this is true at all.  Which isn't to say it never happens.  But there is a stigma surrounding sex industries which somehow criminalizes people who work in them.  I have serious problems with this. 

Issues of a person not being able to manage the balance between pornography and his or her sexual partner are issues of that person/relationship, not the industry.  Suppose I nursed an unhealthy infatuation with Colin Firth, and plastered my walls with posters of him and watched his movies all day and insisted on calling my boyfriend "Mr. Firth."   Same thing.  That means something isn't right with me/the relationship, not with Colin Firth's work or image.  It would be foolish of my boyfriend to say "Colin Firth makes me feel inadequate."  And if he feels this way, he needs to communicate that and/or dump my sorry ass pronto. 

(Not that that actually happened.....*shifty eyes*.............. ;D)

I also think that issues of feeling inadequate due to pornography are issues of our greater relationship with sexuality, not of pornographic imagery.  If women embraced their sexuality and were more confident and comfortable with it, they would not be intimidated by sexual imagery.

Doesn't mean I think bombardment with huge fake titties is called for.  But I think porn as a concept, and many types of porn, are great.  There is way too much of a stigma around sex in this country.  I mean, look at our current administration's attitude toward sexuality.  Oy.

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P.S. I'm really really excited for this debate.  Good topic, ledzep!

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I pretty much agree with KMK with the exception that I sometimes watch it.

Do I expect women to act like that in real life?  No.
Do I like the types of porn that shows only the woman pleasing the man?  No.
Does it offend and bother me when the man is causing the woman pain, emotional or physical?  YES.
Is the only porn I watch and get excitement from the type that shows both partners being pleasured?  Yes.
Should porn be chosen over your partner?  HELL NO!
Have I ever been to a strip club?  Yes.
Did I enjoy that experience?  No.
Will I ever go to a strip club again?  No.
Did I come to my friend's bachelor party late so I wouldn't be there for the stripper?  Yes.
Is it because I thought it was wrong and it made me uncomfortable?  Yes.
Did they know this?  Yes, I'm not too macho to let them know things like that.  I'm pretty much the outcast in my group of friends.  I was pleased to hear that it made my little brother uncomfortable.  I have hopefully taught him well.

I hope I don't get ripped to shreds since I watch porn.  I don't watch it all the time.

Cappy, I'm sorry that happened to you.  It's hard for me to imagine that someone would choose that over you. :-\

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Suppose I nursed an unhealthy infatuation with Colin Firth, and plastered my walls with posters of him and watched his movies all day and insisted on calling my boyfriend "Mr. Firth."   Same thing.  That means something isn't right with me/the relationship, not with Colin Firth's work or image.  It would be foolish of my boyfriend to say "Colin Firth makes me feel inadequate."  And if he feels this way, he needs to communicate that and/or dump my sorry ass pronto. 

My ex had an infatuation with Ben Affleck and she made it a point to constantly let me know this.  She even ran off to watch the Pearl Harbor movie trailer while I was trying to be all loveydovey with her and tell her sweet nothings. >:(

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I pretty much agree with KMK with the exception that I sometimes watch it.

I never said I don't watch it.

Also, I feel like many of us here envision porn as movies which there is a big macho guy with a huge penis having his way with one or more big-chested, skinny-waisted women.  That is only one, stereotypical type of porn. 

But I'll say it again--take control of your sexuality!  Instead of saying, "I hope I am not expected to look/act/bend that way.... :-\" everyone just needs to talk to his or her partner about likes and dislikes, like HH says.  It may not be a good idea to have a sexual relationship with someone in the first place if those doubts and uncertainties are there, but that's a matter of personal preference.  If your partner's expectations are uncomfortable and unreasonable, time to move on with life.  The end.  No time for losers.

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Sorry KMK--I don't have a slew of studies to qualify that there are women, minors, men, etc. being used involitarry in the industry--honestly it's not a subject I spend too much time contempalting or researching. I suppose I assumed that some were as I was thinking on a more global basis--there are not always safty laws or regulations in palce to protect people in this industry in other countries.

Honestly--my personal experiences with porn totally taints my view of it so I will excuse myself from this debate.

Now behave in here--remember this is still a family site  ;D

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I pretty much agree with KMK with the exception that I sometimes watch it.

I never said I don't watch it.

Also, I feel like many of us here envision porn as movies which there is a big macho guy with a huge penis having his way with one or more big-chested, skinny-waisted women.  That is only one, stereotypical type of porn. 

But I'll say it again--take control of your sexuality!  Instead of saying, "I hope I am not expected to look/act/bend that way.... :-\" everyone just needs to talk to his or her partner about likes and dislikes, like HH says.  It may not be a good idea to have a sexual relationship with someone in the first place if those doubts and uncertainties are there, but that's a matter of personal preference.  If your partner's expectations are uncomfortable and unreasonable, time to move on with life.  The end.  No time for losers.

KMK, I am wondering what you would recommend...sounds like you have better than average taste in porn ;)b

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Sorry KMK--I don't have a slew of studies to qualify that there are women, minors, men, etc. being used involitarry in the industry--honestly it's not a subject I spend too much time contempalting or researching. I suppose I assumed that some were as I was thinking on a more global basis--there are not always safty laws or regulations in palce to protect people in this industry in other countries.

I feel like you are lumping pornography, sex trafficking, prostitution, and all other "industries" involving "sex trade" of any kind together.  I mean, of course there are people exploited for the sake of any of these (and some are exploitative by definition).  No doubt about it.  But to say, "Porn exploits women" is not entirely accurate.  Does that happen?  Yes.  But is there a whole, huge army of women who choose to work in pornography and find it power in that?  Who embrace it and enjoy the opportunity to express their sexuality?  Hell yes!  The very presumption that any women involved in producing pornographic imagery are doing so against their will reveals our latent sexism and discomfort with female sexuality.  And that's a huge problem.

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KMK, I am wondering what you would recommend...sounds like you have better than average taste in porn ;)b

Eh, not really.  I knew it would come to that, though, hahaha  ;D

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Now behave in here--remember this is still a family site  ;D

Since when do we do that?  ;)

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I'd say my biggest miff with it is that its so dangerous or rough or what have you. There is  some pretty extreme stuff going on, stuff that I don't care how much they seem  like, cannot be pleasant and most likely hurts or is humiliating. This is a family site as Capture said, so I won't go into specifics, but it seems like the girls are being forced to do it or someone is making them feel like they have to do certain things to get work. Also, I heard somewhere that its against California law to have bodiliy fluids to touch skin.

And I don't consider myself a prude, I just don't want sex in my face all the time. That includes young girls wearing shorts with the word "naughty" over the butt or chicks dressed like they work the day shift of a strip club. Or guys being very crude and cat calling me when I decide to wear shorts wihen its 100 degrees outside. I just think everything is way too sexualized, I don't have a problem with sexuality or the human interest in sex  at all as I like to look at naked bodies (attractive  ones), I just don't want it up in my face 24/7.

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Sorry KMK--I don't have a slew of studies to qualify that there are women, minors, men, etc. being used involuntary in the industry--honestly it's not a subject I spend too much time contemplating or researching. I suppose I assumed that some were as I was thinking on a more global basis--there are not always safty laws or regulations in palce to protect people in this industry in other countries.

I feel like you are lumping pornography, sex trafficking, prostitution, and all other "industries" involving "sex trade" of any kind together.  I mean, of course there are people exploited for the sake of any of these (and some are exploitative by definition).  No doubt about it.  But to say, "Porn exploits women" is not entirely accurate.  Does that happen?  Yes.  But is there a whole, huge army of women who choose to work in pornography and find it power in that?  Who embrace it and enjoy the opportunity to express their sexuality?  Hell yes!  The very presumption that any women involved in producing pornographic imagery are doing so against their will reveals our latent sexism and discomfort with female sexuality.  And that's a huge problem.

You can embrace your sexuality while not in porn. And it may not be totally against their will, but I think a lot of them go into porn for one reason and have no idea what they are getting themselves into. I doubt any of them would feel very powerful if they got an STD or HIV. A few years ago, there was a story about some Canadian girl who did a porno for some money (doing some very extreme stuff) and contracted HIV. There was a fundraiser set up for her and she's received only $1500. Also, there was another woman who contracted it and I think she tried to sue some porn company for wokers comp, and I don't know how it turned out.

And maybe its not necessarily female sexuality thats the problem, and if it is- what's new? That's been going on since the beginning of time and will continue and I girls having sex on camera for money is going to change that. They're just hookers on film to me.

And porn is primarily created to tantalize men. Would most of these men wish to marry or have a serious relationship with a woman who sells herself? Or do they only wish to use them as fatasy material then forget about them?

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You don't have to date or be with anyone who doesn't hold the same values as you.  If you are more conservative and date someone conservative, you'll be fine.  Relationships are about compatibility and trust.

And I don't consider myself a prude, I just don't want sex in my face all the time. That includes young girls wearing shorts with the word "naughty" over the butt or chicks dressed like they work the day shift of a strip club. Or guys being very crude and cat calling me when I decide to wear shorts wihen its 100 degrees outside.

1.  I guess I don't worry about shorts with lettering.  I don't consider it sexuality in my face.  I don't think that the girls/women who wear shorts with lettering on the back want to invite random advances.  That's kind of like the rapist defense of "you could tell she wanted it by how short her skirt was."  (I had a class in college where we talked about that for a week.)

2.  I've never been around anyone who has been cat called, so maybe it's regional to where you live.

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I see what you're getting at, ledzep, but there are waaaaaay too many generalizations and assumptions there:

You can embrace your sexuality while not in porn.

Agreed. You can.

And it may not be totally against their will, but I think a lot of them go into porn for one reason and have no idea what they are getting themselves into.

How do you know?  That's a huge blanket statement.

I doubt any of them would feel very powerful if they got an STD or HIV. A few years ago, there was a story about some Canadian girl who did a porno for some money (doing some very extreme stuff) and contracted HIV. There was a fundraiser set up for her and she's received only $1500. Also, there was another woman who contracted it and I think she tried to sue some porn company for wokers comp, and I don't know how it turned out.

STI's are very carefully monitored in professional sex workers.  They are tested all the time--monthly if not more often.  There is no messing around with STI's.  When a person gets an STI, which is rare, it's because of someone's mistake in not administering the proper testing.  That has nothing to do with whether pornography is good or harmful as an industry or idea.

Also, what do you mean by extreme? 

And maybe its not necessarily female sexuality thats the problem, and if it is- what's new? That's been going on since the beginning of time and will continue and I girls having sex on camera for money is going to change that. They're just hookers on film to me.

That is downright offensive.  If I chose to, say, create nude photos of myself and sell them, would I be a hooker?  Women who choose to work in other areas of the pornographic industries are no different.

And porn is primarily created to tantalize men. Would most of these men wish to marry or have a serious relationship with a woman who sells herself? Or do they only wish to use them as fatasy material then forget about them?

False.  Historically, a disproportionate amount of porn has been created to tantalize men.  Agreed.  But that is not the primary purpose of erotic imagery itself.  Porn is whatever someone creates that someone else finds erotic. 

Also, fantasies are perfectly healthy, in my opinion.  There are tons of male figures/images that I might use as sexual fantasies and then forget about them.  I don't think there's anything wrong with that.  Fantasies are good and healthy.

Again, you can't throw the baby out with the bathwater.  Just because injustices occur within the these industries does not mean porn is inherently bad.

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